Rules of Ultimate governed by the World Flying Disc Federation

Is this a Dangerous Play? Hitted and injured during an upline :(

  • Xu Hao
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6 months 4 weeks ago #2658 by Xu Hao
Hi, I'm a player from China who played 9 years and WFDF U24 in Perth and Heidelberg. You may know there are many new clubs and players (ten thousand of) appeared in China during the 2021-22. Many of them are different from the players before —— attracted by the amazing sports, training hard but don’t have time to learn the rules/spirit. Though many good players like me became the coaches, there are still some of "coaches" who only played half-1 year and don’t know too much about the SOTG.Video Link: 
 3 months ago when I played a fun scrimmage, I was contacted many time from a team (Because I'm the best player in the team). 1. In the first time (00:19), My knee was hitted and then I was stripped, I called foul.   2.Then the second time (00:36), I was hitted by a player who always ignore my (any my team member's) position, I noticed that is dangerous (• running without looking when there is a likelihood of other players occupying the space into which the player is traveling),  So I called "Dangerous Play. However, he didn't agree that is a DP and also believe that's not a foul. Try to talk but failed.3.Third time (00:54), I did an upline and the thrower did a bad throw. I believe he may didn't look at me so I give up to jump and try to avoid a contact (Too many times), but he still jumped to my position and hit me. I want to call a spirit timeout, but the time is limited. I thought I was called DP before, so I give up to call anything.4. Last time (From 0:01-00:18), I did an upline (In the next round, only after one minute of 3.) jumped and catched but then my back was hitted violently by his shoulder. At that time, I was still in the air, the hit broke the balance and then I landed in one leg. I feel so pain and hurt. After that I went to the hospital, it shows that I injured my ACL+MCL+Meniscus... I must do surgery and rest for a long time. After seeing the video, me and many experienced players of China says that is absolutely a dangerous play. Especially when it happened after many contacts and even a dangerous play call. According to the examples, I think 3&4&8 are good to describe this case. Chinese website [bilibili] Link (Video is same. Not sure if it could be opened outside of the China. Need the APP to see the comments):  b23.tv/NuTFmZq However, the player who hurt me didn't agree it's a Dangerous play or even a foul. Some of comments in in the video said "It is normal in Football, why we couldn't do this in Ultimate Frisbee?" "Ultimate means contact" "You are only unlucky to hurt, but we'll still do this in the next time." In the vote of the case (109 participants now): Only 61% viewers chose "It is a dangerous play", 25% viewers believes that "It is not a DP", 13.64% of them chose "Not sure".  Consider most of the experienced players chose "It's a DP", we can estimate that more than 50% of the new players dont think it is a DP and many of them will not agree the call even after the other team notice that —— until they hurt someone like me. 
 As an experienced player who loved Frisbee so much. I feel so angry and fear.  It is sad to know that they are ten thousand of potential risk players now. I'm trying to accept an interview in China now. Before the big discussion with the Chinese ultimate players, I want to know whether it is a Dangerous Play, I really need the support and advice from the WFDF. If it is a DP, please give me a explaination and then I'll have the courage to face the 25%+14% peple!

More and more players were hurt during the Ultimate frisbee games. Some of them may say goodbye to the field. Really hope what I'm doing could change this condition. It is fashion, but it should be safe! Please "save" the SOTG in China!

Thanks a lot!

The following are non-exhaustive examples of dangerous play:
  1. significantly colliding with a mostly stationary opponent,
  2. jumping into a group of mostly stationary players,
  3. diving around or through a player that results in contact with a player's back or legs,
  4. running without looking when there is a likelihood of other players occupying the space into which the player is traveling,
  5. jumping or otherwise leaving the ground where it is likely that a significant collision will result,
  6. wild or uncontrolled throwing motions,
  7. initiating contact with a player's head,
  8. initiating contact with an airborne player's lower body that prevents them from landing on their feet, and
  9. jumping right in front of a sprinting player in a manner where contact is unavoidable
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6 months 4 weeks ago #2660 by rueben
It is too difficult to tell from this footage exactly what has happened. More angels would give us a clearer idea. While it iseemsthat most of these are fouls, it is not clear if they are dangerous plays (although the first incident seems the most likely).

Regardless statements like this are completely incorrect:
"It is normal in Football, why we couldn't do this in Ultimate Frisbee?"
"Ultimate means contact"

A very important rule to remind players of is rule 12.6:
All players must attempt to avoid contact with other players, and there is no situation where a player may justify initiating contact. This includes avoiding initiating contact with a stationary opponent, or an opponent’s expected position based on their established speed and direction. “Making a play for the disc” is not a valid excuse for initiating contact with other players.

I would be more than happy to have an online discussion via video with your community if you thought that would be useful.

Rueben Berg
Chair
WFDF Ultimate Rules Sub-Committee

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